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Post Info TOPIC: Understanding our Mustang's suspension


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Understanding our Mustang's suspension


This thread is to help you better understand the basics on your mustangs suspension, and what to look at when upgrading.
there is a lot you can do to improve your car's traction and handling. there are also flaw's in the mustangs suspension
design that should be addressed. you can go a little or a lot, but I want this forum to help you understand what works well, and what doesn't.

For starters, let me tell you from firsthand experience that the mustang's suspension is not a simple as you may think.
for a basic understanding of the suspension parts, and how they work
LOOK HERE > www.miracerros.com/mustang/t_suspension.htm

The stock mustang suffers from soft bushings, and poor rear control arm geometry. Wheel hop, axle deflection, body flex and a tall ride height. these all contribute to mediocre handling at best, and mediocre traction when launching hard... especially when compared to newer cars.

Front Suspension Definition:
The 1979-2004 Mustang front suspension consists of modified MacPherson struts with lower control arms (A-arms).

This suspension is compact, cheap to build and easy to service, but it is often criticized because (a) its geometry produces camber changes during vertical suspension movement and body roll that adversely affect handling and (b) the strut towers prevent designers from lowering the car's profile. The performance of the front suspension can be improved by installing stiffer springs and struts and by replacing rubber bushings in several locations with less compliant urethane bushings.

Rear Suspension Definition: the 1979-2004 Mustang's 4-link rear suspension consists of a live rear axle held in position by upper and lower control arms, coil springs, and gas-filled shock absorbers. It includes an 8.8" traction lock rear, quad shocks (shocks & dampers), and a rear sway bar.

When the car leans (rolls) in a turn, one side of the chassis moves upward relative to the rear axle, the other side moves downward, and these non-parallel control arms must twist and change length axially to allow the axle to articulate. This causes the control arm bushings to bind. If this bind becomes excessive, it can raise the rear wheel rate and produce sudden, undesireable changes in handling

Ford minimizes this suspension bind by using compliant rubber bushings in both the upper and lower control arms. These relatively "soft" bushings acommodate the necessary motion of the control arms during body roll. However, they also permit wheel hop on hard launches and horizontal axle deflection in aggressive turns.
[IRS equipped cobras are obviously different]

I won't put everything in here, as there are many options and upgrades you can do to improve your cars ride, traction and handling.
I've done and redone my car's entire suspension. and learned a lot along the way.
I have all MM parts except for my K member. I have tried Steeda, Grannitelli and QA1.
The major differences on my ride are the coilovers and 3-link rear with a panhard rod.
The handling is so far superior to the car as it was. it's stable, predictable and corners so solid. launches are straight and rear traction is vastly improved. you have to feel it to believe it.


WHERE TO START!
Most mustang owners start with lowering their car, for appearance and handling, and upgrade or replace their worn out LCA's.
Lower control arms are definitely the place to start - it goes on from there.

You'd be surprised how much better your car feels lowered, with wider/better tires!!

I'll be adding more information to this section as time goes on. If you have questions I suggest you do 2 things.

1 - Ask about it on the forum here...
2 - check with someone who runs, builds and or tests the part your looking at!
I'd sum this up with a,b,c & d.

a - there's a difference between forum opinion or regurgitation of information and someone who has actually done the upgrade.
b - just because someone has done a suspension upgrade and tells you "it's great" or "it's fine" doesn't necessarily mean that's
true, or mean that's the right part for your car. Ask those who have done it, and find out what works and why!
c - I recommend you check with Maximum Motorsports or Griggs. they engineer, build and test their parts, and explain why
it works better on your mustang. I am not affilliated with them in any way (I wish they would be one of our sponsors!!)
But, I've learned the hard way on this one. Trust me, you WANT to check with Maximum Motorsports, web site or phone
their tech line, they're great to explain what works and why. I respect that. They've helped me with my car, even with
other manufacturers parts!
d - Cheaper parts, are just that, Cheap - poor quality, no design, crappy assembly, and sometimes can cause harm to your
cars and have unpredictable or undesirable performance.
DON"T BELIEVE ALL THE SALES HYPE out there!!


For starters most mustang owners want to lower their car by way of springs.
if you lower your car, you will want to do caster camber plates because your camber will be out and the stock adjustments arn't enough. I only suggest Maximum Motorsports CC plates. they the strongest and best out there. if your running coilovers, all the front weight of the car is sitting on the plates! so they are my only choice for coil over applications

Lastly I highly suggest you find out why you do not want solid or adjustable upper control arms on your STREET driven car!
Torque box reinforcements? if you need to reinforce the torque box, or someone says you need to, there's something wrong there....
Your suspension should not bind up and warp the floor pan of your car! these kinds of parts are cheap fixes for drag racing vehicles.

I offer this bit of information from Maximum Motorsports web site to explain why: - rear suspension - lower control arms.
Most aftermarket rear control arms use hard 2-piece urethane bushings, Delrin bushings, or steel bushings. Those types of bushings do not allow the angularity needed for the Mustangs suspension to articulate freely. The resulting suspension bind causes the rear tires to break loose very easily. Suspension bind not only causes poor handling and poor traction, but it also causes damage to the torque-boxes. As the attachment points on the chassis for the rear control arms, the torque-boxes can suffer greatly from the abuse of poorly designed control arm bushings. After all, the torque boxes are only made of folded sheet metal.....

AND

....In the Mustangs rear suspension design, whether it is still the stock 4-link suspension design, or has been modified to a Torque-arm or three-link design, the control arms do not simply pivot. The arms also move sideways, with an angular motion (relative to the pivot axis). If that angular motion is restricted because of a poor bushing design, the suspension will bind. While some aftermarket control arms may seem to improve performance because of reduced bushing compliance, it is only improved to a level slightly higher than the stock control arms. Once the car is pushed past that level, the increased wheel rate from the suspension bind will cause unpredictable handling not to mention damage to the torque boxes.

On that note, don't get pissed off if you run uppers and that stuff. for mild street driving and drag racing where you go in a straight line only. you can get buy with that stuff. but it absolutely will bind up and restrict the movement of your supsension as defined above.
IMO it's rediculous if you want any serious kind of street or cornering performance, good corner exit, and predicitability while accerating on an uneven road...




The mustang suspension has been around for a long time - and can be seriously improved.
Good modding to all! :)

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peace, love and go fuck yourself!!!!! \m/ (-_-) \m/


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whos reaaaaaaaaaaaly gonna read that

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9greeNotch3 wrote:

whos reaaaaaaaaaaaly gonna read that





me, plus why do you constanly post in threads that have no meaning to you???

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07 ZO6 - Bone Stock... Sure "DC Crew"


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cuz ur a goofy fuck with a gay avatar...and paul has posted in the 79-93 area to so suck it asshole

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Josh, I agree. Way too long just to say it's a triangluated four link with deflection issues from the factory.

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GOOD SHIT!YOU CAN NOCK OFF 1 SEC PLUS WITH SOME SUPENSIONS IN 1/4 MILE,WITHOUT ADDING HORSEPOWER,HOTCHKIS USES THIS AS A SELLING POINT.doggy

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JIM


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9T9MnyPit wrote:

9greeNotch3 wrote:

whos reaaaaaaaaaaaly gonna read that





me, plus why do you constanly post in threads that have no meaning to you???


x2

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Josh, of your 2400 plus posts, has even one added to the content of this site?

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Death is my art and I'm about to paint my masterpiece.


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There is a lot that goes into suspension setups. It is a little long and drawn out, but there are so many variables you can't be thorough and not cover it all. I skimmed it but didn't notice anything on another major 04 and older issue, weight bias. These cars are front end heavy which is bad. Most a/m k members move the wheels forward which helps to reduce this.

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Nick Papageorgio wrote:

There is a lot that goes into suspension setups. It is a little long and drawn out, but there are so many variables you can't be thorough and not cover it all. I skimmed it but didn't notice anything on another major 04 and older issue, weight bias. These cars are front end heavy which is bad. Most a/m k members move the wheels forward which helps to reduce this.





Then you run into rubbing issues. Like my 03. Sharp turns are pointless now on loose shock settings. But damn does the front end rise. The rear of the car rides great though with spherical bushings.

-- Edited by mustang guy at 22:02, 2008-05-22

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mustang guy wrote:

Nick Papageorgio wrote:

There is a lot that goes into suspension setups. It is a little long and drawn out, but there are so many variables you can't be thorough and not cover it all. I skimmed it but didn't notice anything on another major 04 and older issue, weight bias. These cars are front end heavy which is bad. Most a/m k members move the wheels forward which helps to reduce this.





Then you run into rubbing issues. Like my 03. Sharp turns are pointless now on loose shock settings. But damn does the front end rise. The rear of the car rides great though with spherical bushings.

-- Edited by mustang guy at 22:02, 2008-05-22




What K member and where does it rub? There won't be any rubbing issues if you are using the correct wheel/tire size and install the K properly. Did you square the K member up correctly? Most tolerances allowed are 1/4" on wheelbase tops and 1/8" when you center it. Its very easy to be off slightly when squaring it up and that can cause issues.

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Nick Papageorgio wrote:

mustang guy wrote:

Nick Papageorgio wrote:

There is a lot that goes into suspension setups. It is a little long and drawn out, but there are so many variables you can't be thorough and not cover it all. I skimmed it but didn't notice anything on another major 04 and older issue, weight bias. These cars are front end heavy which is bad. Most a/m k members move the wheels forward which helps to reduce this.





Then you run into rubbing issues. Like my 03. Sharp turns are pointless now on loose shock settings. But damn does the front end rise. The rear of the car rides great though with spherical bushings.

-- Edited by mustang guy at 22:02, 2008-05-22




What K member and where does it rub? There won't be any rubbing issues if you are using the correct wheel/tire size and install the K properly. Did you square the K member up correctly? Most tolerances allowed are 1/4" on wheelbase tops and 1/8" when you center it. Its very easy to be off slightly when squaring it up and that can cause issues.



Everything is in perfect. The tires are just to wide now. I didn't really want to get into it then. But I have a k with offet lca's.

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mustang guy wrote:

Nick Papageorgio wrote:

mustang guy wrote:

Nick Papageorgio wrote:

There is a lot that goes into suspension setups. It is a little long and drawn out, but there are so many variables you can't be thorough and not cover it all. I skimmed it but didn't notice anything on another major 04 and older issue, weight bias. These cars are front end heavy which is bad. Most a/m k members move the wheels forward which helps to reduce this.





Then you run into rubbing issues. Like my 03. Sharp turns are pointless now on loose shock settings. But damn does the front end rise. The rear of the car rides great though with spherical bushings.

-- Edited by mustang guy at 22:02, 2008-05-22




What K member and where does it rub? There won't be any rubbing issues if you are using the correct wheel/tire size and install the K properly. Did you square the K member up correctly? Most tolerances allowed are 1/4" on wheelbase tops and 1/8" when you center it. Its very easy to be off slightly when squaring it up and that can cause issues.



Everything is in perfect. The tires are just to wide now. I didn't really want to get into it then. But I have a k with offet lca's.


.

you answered my question. its not the K causing issues, its the offset arms as you probably know. You can get them to work. Griggs Racing runs 10.5's on the front of a fox body w/ some modification to make it work.

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I have a upr k-member with coil overs. I have 275/35/18s in the front with no issues..

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